Forum Message

Topic: Re:Support from David Cameron
Posted by: Francis Rowe
Date/Time: 12/11/10 14:13:00

Malcolm, I don't think you should be so dismissive of hypothetical examples as they can clarify basic principles or at least give pause for thought to some of those with fixed mindsets.

Despite some very eloquent and interesting posts in this thread (and in the case of Fraser Pearce quite eye-opening) I still believe that most people have missed the point. Torture is evil and shouldn't be condoned but torturers are not necessarily evil people with evil motives. If you accept, as I do, that if you find yourself in a position where the only way to prevent a greater evil is to commit a lesser one you are morally bound to act then you also accept that torture is something you would have to do.

My example is purely theoretical. In the real world of course there are uncertainties, the intelligence is never that reliable, you won't know for sure the nature or scale of the attack, you won't know whether your suspect has the information, the issues are never going to be so clear cut that your options are plain. Most people replying to this thread have avoided answering the original question which excluded these uncertainties which leads me to believe that they would do the same as me but are not prepared to admit to it.


Entire Thread
TopicDate PostedPosted By
'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 08:38:00 Francis Rowe
   Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 09:01:00 Bobby Charlton
      Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 10:21:00 Jonathan Bingham
         Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 11:03:00 Francis Rowe
            Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 11:41:00 Jonathan Bingham
            Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 18:56:00 Lou Valdini
      Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 11:54:00 Thomas Barry
         Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 12:22:00 C Wynne
            Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 13:47:00 Vanessa Smith
   Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 11:03:00 Keith Iddon
   Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 11:13:00 Thomas Barry
      Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 14:44:00 John Connelly
         Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 15:19:00 Malcolm Peltu
            Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 15:38:00 Bobby Charlton
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 16:57:00 Malcolm Peltu
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 17:49:00 Jonathan Bingham
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'09/11/10 20:59:00 Andy Wright
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 08:41:00 Francis Rowe
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 09:58:00 Jonathan Bingham
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 12:15:00 Francis Rowe
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 13:18:00 Patrick ONeill
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 13:34:00 Vanessa Smith
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 10:54:00 Vanessa Smith
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 11:41:00 Malcolm Peltu
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 11:43:00 Ceref Devin
                                 Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 11:53:00 Keith Iddon
                                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 12:59:00 Neil Muller
                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 13:59:00 Malcolm Peltu
                                          Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 15:04:00 Neil Muller
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 15:11:00 C Wynne
                                                Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 15:57:00 Neil Muller
                                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 16:22:00 C Wynne
                                                      Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 16:37:00 Neil Muller
                                                         Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'11/11/10 16:04:00 C Wynne
   Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 14:06:00 Ceref Devin
      Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 14:20:00 Malcolm Peltu
         Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 14:45:00 John Connelly
            Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 15:49:00 Brian Haining
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 16:06:00 Fraser Pearce
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 16:09:00 Ben Willcocks
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 16:24:00 Jonathan Bingham
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 16:28:00 Neil Muller
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 18:23:00 Alastair Banton
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'10/11/10 18:39:00 Tina Pemberton
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'11/11/10 16:00:00 Malcolm Peltu
                                 Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'11/11/10 16:11:00 Michael Mccaffrey
                                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'11/11/10 16:37:00 Malcolm Peltu
                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'11/11/10 16:57:00 Michael Mccaffrey
                                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'11/11/10 17:32:00 Tina Pemberton
                                       Support from David Cameron12/11/10 09:44:00 Malcolm Peltu
                                          Re:Support from David Cameron12/11/10 14:13:00 Francis Rowe
                                             Re:Re:Support from David Cameron12/11/10 14:46:00 Jonathan Bingham
                                                Re:Re:Re:Support from David Cameron12/11/10 15:38:00 Malcolm Peltu
                                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Support from David Cameron13/11/10 09:21:00 Francis Rowe
                                                      Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Support from David Cameron13/11/10 09:53:00 Jonathan Bingham
   Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'15/11/10 07:19:00 Monica Devlin
      Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'15/11/10 12:44:00 Malcolm Peltu
         Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'15/11/10 13:42:00 Neil Muller
            Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'15/11/10 13:51:00 C Wynne
            Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'15/11/10 14:36:00 Jonathan Bingham
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'15/11/10 15:01:00 Neil Muller
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:'UK Lives Saved by Waterboarding'16/11/10 10:18:00 Michael Mccaffrey

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