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Topic: Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick
Posted by: Tom Pike
Date/Time: 09/02/08 17:41:00

Jeff, taking you second question first, if you were to take the current Heathrow traffic and spread it over three rather than two runways, it would have a larger 57 dB Leq contour area than at present – a third runway with the current aircraft leads to Heathrow contraction as you’d need to scale back the number of flights to avoid breaching the contour-area cap. BAA have to assume future aircraft are less noisy to have any justification for building a third runway.

If they build a third runway and the aircraft noise levels have not decreased by as much as they hoped for, BAA will be very tempted to concentrate departures on the central runway to make most efficient use of the extra capacity – Grove Park would fall silent!

"If it's only a little maths..."

It's this much, taking it a step at a time:

If the total acoustic power from planes passing over a location for a time T is P, then the dB Leq at that point will be

dBLeq = 10 log (P/T) = 10 log P – 10 log T

Adding in an additional plane of acoustic power Q, the new Leq will be

dBLeqNew = 10 log (P+Q) - 10 log T

The increase in the Leq will be

dBLeqInc = dBLeqNew – dBLeq = 10 log(P + Q) – log P = 10 log (1+Q/P)

As the power from the one plane is much less than the power from all of the rest, Q/P will be much less than 1. We can therefore make the approximation that for x much less than 1, log (1+x) = x, or

dBLeqInc = 10 Q/P

Comparing the increase in the dBLeq from two flightpaths of power P1 and P2:

dBLeqInc1/ dBLeqInc2 = P2/P1

If the power, p,  is expressed in dB,

p = 10 log P

or

P = 10^(p/10)

So

dBLeqInc1/ dBLeqInc2 = 10^[(p2 – p1)/10]

Hence if the two flightpaths have a 4 dB difference in noise, an additional plane will make 10^(4/10) or 2.5 times the contribution to the Leq of the quieter flightpath.

Minimising Leq values will tend to concentrate additional noise on already noisy areas, meaning less increase in noise in quieter areas such as Chiswick at the expense of noisier areas such as Cranford.


Entire Thread
TopicDate PostedPosted By
3rd runway noise in Chiswick01/02/08 18:48:00 Jeff Gear
   Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick01/02/08 18:59:00 Jim Lawes
      Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick01/02/08 19:52:00 Paul Morris
         Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 09:16:00 Tim Henderson
   Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick01/02/08 21:17:00 Jonathan Bingham
      Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick01/02/08 23:22:00 Jim Lawes
         Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 13:39:00 Lou Valdini
   Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 02:50:00 Richard Jennings
   Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 09:25:00 Tom Pike
      Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 11:36:00 Jeff Gear
         Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 11:45:00 Russell Peirs
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 11:56:00 Tim Henderson
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 12:03:00 Richard Jennings
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 12:48:00 Paul Morris
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 15:16:00 Tom Pike
         Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick04/02/08 18:48:00 Jonathan Bingham
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 13:08:00 Jeff Gear
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 13:24:00 Jane Davison
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 14:48:00 Jonathan Bingham
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 15:28:00 Jeff Gear
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 16:27:00 Tom Pike
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 18:10:00 Jeff Gear
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 18:44:00 Tom Pike
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 20:05:00 Jeff Gear
                                 Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 20:42:00 Tom Pike
                                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick07/02/08 12:51:00 Jeff Gear
                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick07/02/08 19:23:00 Tim Henderson
                                          Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick07/02/08 21:43:00 Richard Jennings
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick07/02/08 22:16:00 Tim Henderson
                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick08/02/08 08:06:00 Tom Pike
                                          Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick08/02/08 17:40:00 Jeff Gear
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick08/02/08 19:53:00 Tom Pike
                                                Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick09/02/08 00:47:00 Tom Pike
                                                Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick09/02/08 12:28:00 Jeff Gear
                                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick09/02/08 17:20:00 Tim Henderson
                                                      Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick09/02/08 17:46:00 Tom Pike
                                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick09/02/08 17:41:00 Tom Pike
                                                      Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick10/02/08 13:06:00 Jeff Gear
      Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 15:50:00 Jeff Gear
         Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 16:16:00 Tim Henderson
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 17:34:00 Jane Davison
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 19:09:00 Tim Henderson
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 19:37:00 Tom Pike
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 20:07:00 Tim Henderson
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 12:45:00 Tom Pike
         Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 18:34:00 Tom Pike
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 20:30:00 Paul Morris
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 21:07:00 Jo Smith
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 12:46:00 Tom Pike
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 22:13:00 Jeff Gear
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 12:47:00 Tom Pike
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick02/02/08 22:25:00 Richard Jennings
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 12:49:00 Tom Pike
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 16:18:00 Richard Jennings
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 18:36:00 Tom Pike
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 18:51:00 Tom Pike
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 21:56:00 Richard Jennings
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 23:41:00 Tom Pike
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 12:50:00 Paul Morris
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 13:36:00 Tom Pike
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 14:39:00 Tim Henderson
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick03/02/08 18:59:00 Tom Pike
   Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 05:15:00 David Lindsay
      Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 19:13:00 Paul Morris
         Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick05/02/08 22:03:00 Jane Davison
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick06/02/08 12:13:00 Russell Peirs
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick06/02/08 12:14:00 Russell Peirs
            Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick06/02/08 13:26:00 Jonathan Bingham
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick07/02/08 21:50:00 David Giles
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick07/02/08 21:52:00 Paul Morris
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:3rd runway noise in Chiswick07/02/08 22:45:00 Richard Jennings

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