Forum Message

Topic: Response to Cllr Sam (might be TLTR for some!)
Posted by: Ed Saper
Date/Time: 29/05/21 10:58:00

Councillor Sam:
“We are not anti-bike or anti-car we are for a balanced approach to London's transport ills and specifically those of this borough."

I took a look at the last manifesto on your website and the only policy relating to cycling is:

"We will require TfL to introduce cyclist appropriate road schemes but we will not support anything that adds to traffic congestion and air pollution e.g. CS9."

Cycling gets a mention as part of your air pollution policy which also includes opposing the ULEZ, so one of the few measures you’ll take to limit pollution relate to prioritising cars over bikes. 

I don't know when in 2019 you published the Walking & Cycling Policy, but in September 2019 you were the third signatory on the petition to reject the cycle lane:

"We deplore the way that TfL has ignored the clearly expressed views of the residents of Chiswick and urge Hounslow Council to reject TfL's proposal to build a segregated two-way cycle super-highway (CS9) along Chiswick High Road."

I note that your position shifted a bit in May 2020 when your new cycling policy indicated a wish to "move on from the controversy in Chiswick about Cycleway 9 and find a new consensus”.  The cycling consensus includes:

- Removing the temporary cycle lane and doing another consultation (what was wrong with the last one?);
- A stripped down C9 if there’s support;
- Civil enforcement officers to police cyclists; and
- Car parking.


If the Tory manifesto cycling policy is to remove the cycle lane because it gets in the way of cars, if you sign petitions to remove it, if your arguments are that bikes increase air pollution but you won’t countenance any measure that might reduce car pollution, then I'm really struggling to understand how you're not at least pro-car! 

It is also hard to avoid the conclusion that you're "anti-bike" when you align with The OC and complain "we know the members of the pressure group that Hounslow Council are listening to amount to less than 0.1% of the Borough's population. This is about as far away from democracy as one can get."

This is a talking point that is frequently made by those associated with The OC - e.g David Riley's post:
"LCC local branch Hounslow Cycling and friends and associates do not represent real cyclists nor society widely in Chiswick, let alone Hounslow or across London.  It represents less than 0.1% of society, but a 0.1% that thinks it should dictate to the 99.9% of society and that is not democracy."

You’re well aware that The OC isn’t just about lobbying against cycling infrastructure, many of its members really don’t like cyclists - particularly their sanctimonious moralising about how they’re “saving the planet” and how they refuse to follow the rules (which you’ll fix with an army of enforcers!).

Not that The OC doesn’t sanctimoniously moralise itself about the needs of poor people, disabled people, children, elderly people etc. and then accuses all cyclists (“shame on you”) of not caring about these groups.

We've got a car, we've got bikes - we tend to ride them to skip the traffic, get some exercise and take the kids to school.

I don’t identify as a pedestrian if I decide to walk to the supermarket instead of drive and I support the provision of safe pavements (not that I would think about it!). 

But on this forum and in this debate, you are a "cyclist" and part of the "0.1%"  if you choose to use a bike for some journeys and want safe cycle lanes.  (And now also a hypocrite for having a car and of course answerable on behalf of all cyclists!)

Tribal political movements are defined just as much by those they exclude as include.  The local Tories are currently part of the OneChiswick anti-cyclists / pro cars tribe and since I'm excluded from joining The OC, you have signalled that I’m also excluded from The Tories - I’ve got the message and am trying to “get over it”!


Entire Thread
TopicDate PostedPosted By
Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 11:21:00 Paul Campbell
   Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 11:46:00 Paul Scullion
      Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 12:04:00 Adrian Irving
         Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 12:23:00 Tom Pike
            Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 14:46:00 Adrian Irving
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:02:00 Tom Pike
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:29:00 Chris Vessey
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:43:00 Adrian Irving
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:49:00 Adrian Irving
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 17:54:00 Tom Pike
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 19:35:00 Adrian Irving
   Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 12:07:00 Tom Pike
      Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 12:14:00 Janice Evans
      Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 14:17:00 Paul Campbell
         Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 15:15:00 David Lesniak
   Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 12:16:00 David Lesniak
   Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 12:25:00 Bruce Hammal
      Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 13:41:00 Tom Pike
         Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 13:58:00 Russell Pearson
      Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 14:03:00 Chris Vessey
         Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 14:05:00 Janice Evans
         Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 14:06:00 Bruce Hammal
            Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 15:48:00 Chris Vessey
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:02:00 Bruce Hammal
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:22:00 Chris Vessey
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:34:00 Bruce Hammal
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 17:49:00 Chris Vessey
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:05:00 Will Watson
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 16:07:00 Bruce Hammal
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 17:18:00 Al Webber
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 17:53:00 Chris Vessey
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 17:54:00 Bruce Hammal
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 18:31:00 Chris Vessey
                     A4 alternative28/05/21 04:54:00 David Lesniak
                        Re:A4 alternative28/05/21 06:47:00 Will Watson
                        Re:A4 alternative28/05/21 09:35:00 Chris Vessey
                           Re:Re:A4 alternative28/05/21 13:45:00 David Lesniak
         Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 17:01:00 Loraine Pemberton
            Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 18:00:00 Chris Vessey
               Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 20:12:00 Bernard Allen
                  Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures27/05/21 20:28:00 Russell Pearson
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 08:59:00 Al Webber
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 09:13:00 Janice Evans
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 09:25:00 Al Webber
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 09:44:00 Janice Evans
                     Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 09:40:00 Chris Vessey
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 09:56:00 Russell Pearson
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 15:12:00 Janice Evans
                        Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 13:53:00 Richard Greenhough
                           Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 14:25:00 Chris Vessey
                              Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 14:50:00 Loraine Pemberton
                                 Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 16:03:00 Chris Vessey
                                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 16:25:00 Janice Evans
                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 16:45:00 Janice Evans
                                          Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 16:57:00 Chris Vessey
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 17:08:00 Janice Evans
                                                Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 17:15:00 Loraine Pemberton
                                                   Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 18:44:00 Chris Vessey
                                                   Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 17:17:00 Janice Evans
                                                   Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 18:58:00 Chris Vessey
                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 17:21:00 Cllr Sam Hearn
                                          Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures28/05/21 22:48:00 Philippa Bond
                                             Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 09:26:00 Chris Vessey
                                          Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 07:02:00 Tom Pike
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 08:16:00 Adrian Irving
                                                Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 08:51:00 Tom Pike
                                                   Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 09:08:00 Adrian Irving
                                                      Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 09:57:00 Ed Saper
                                                         Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 10:16:00 Tom Pike
                                                            Response to Cllr Sam (might be TLTR for some!)29/05/21 10:58:00 Ed Saper
                                                               Re:Response to Cllr Sam (might be TLTR for some!)29/05/21 11:57:00 Paul Campbell
                                                                  Re:Re:Response to Cllr Sam (might be TLTR for some!)29/05/21 12:16:00 Ed Saper
                                                               Re:Response to Cllr Sam (might be TLTR for some!)29/05/21 14:43:00 Chris Vessey
                                                            Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 12:27:00 Adrian Irving
                                    Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 15:05:00 David Lesniak
                                       Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 15:49:00 Chris Vessey
                                          Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 16:02:00 David Lesniak
                                             Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Conservatives need strong pro-cycling measures29/05/21 16:21:00 Chris Vessey

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