| Topic: | "The British Public has had enough of experts" | |
| Posted by: | T P Howell | |
| Date/Time: | 03/07/16 11:27:00 |
| Miss Moran, you said earlier in this thread “the EU has done, in practical terms, sweet fa to help either the environment or animal welfare” and you threw out the challenge to “Name one that has had a real effect”. So I took the time to reply. Your response (“Yawn”) was banal. You must be one of the members of the British public who Gove said “have had enough of experts” (i.e. any facts or analysis). But don’t worry, your response was expected. I don’t think you were really interested in a reply to your question, so my reply was not aimed at you. It is it important to put the positive case for the UK’s membership of the EU, and a short explanation as to how the EU makes laws, so your challenge gave the opportunity to do so. Unfortunately, your response echoes the structure of the Referendum debate. It’s the age old technique in politics and in litigation – throw out a one or two liner, however inaccurate or preposterous, knowing that it will take a few pages or hours of explanation to refute – the devil is often in the detail. In that way, you drive the agenda and your opponent spends his or her time explaining why what you said was untrue or just nonsense, but thereby gets distracted from putting forward his or her own positive case. And when he or she finally doesso, just dismiss it with a shrug of the shoulders, or “the British pubic has had enough of experts”, or justify your position on the basis that “all politicians lie”. The problem is, no thought has been given to what comes next: “What the hell do we do now?” (see my posts on the challenges of giving notice under Article 50, and the constitutional requirement for a vote of Parliament). Flippancy and slogans will only get you so far. Now that we get down into the detail you will see that the discussions are far from over. |
| Topic | Date Posted | Posted By |
| Hey! | 01/07/16 16:28:00 | Jill Merrett |
| Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 16:32:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 16:38:00 | Jill Merrett |
| Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 16:41:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 16:54:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 17:08:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:30:00 | Georgina Flint |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:46:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 16:47:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 17:01:00 | Jill Merrett |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 17:11:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 17:47:00 | Adrian Irving |
| Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 17:10:00 | Anita Blake |
| Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 17:15:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 17:34:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 17:39:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 18:00:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 19:23:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 17:27:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 17:42:00 | Dan Evans |
| Re:Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 18:46:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Re:Pants on Fire | 01/07/16 17:56:00 | Will Watson |
| Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 19:09:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 19:13:00 | Will Watson |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Animal Welfare and the Eu | 01/07/16 20:42:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 17:38:00 | Cristina Bur |
| Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:04:00 | Jill Merrett |
| Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:10:00 | Will Watson |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:16:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:17:00 | Jill Merrett |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:38:00 | Anita Blake |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:40:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 20:49:00 | Claire Moran |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 20:50:00 | Claire Moran |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 20:55:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 18:43:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 19:06:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:56:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 18:16:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 19:06:00 | Robert Fish |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 19:12:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 20:37:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 20:46:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 20:54:00 | Claire Moran |
| Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 20:59:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 21:04:00 | Michael Brown |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 21:06:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 21:15:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 01/07/16 21:00:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 02/07/16 09:32:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 02/07/16 10:44:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 02/07/16 10:59:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 02/07/16 11:44:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 02/07/16 18:09:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Not 'hey' but 'oh' | 03/07/16 11:13:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 21:16:00 | Katrina Black |
| Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 21:19:00 | Michael Brown |
| Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 21:21:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 21:37:00 | Susan Kelly |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 21:42:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 01/07/16 21:45:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 09:36:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 10:04:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 10:38:00 | Carrie Reichardt |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 10:49:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:00:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:18:00 | Michael Robinson |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:28:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:32:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 10:48:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:05:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:30:00 | T P Howell |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:43:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:46:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:51:00 | T P Howell |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:56:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Hey! Coooeee TP Howell | 02/07/16 13:13:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Hey! Coooeee TP Howell | 02/07/16 14:20:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 14:54:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:48:00 | Will Watson |
| Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:57:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 17:08:00 | Will Watson |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 17:46:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 17:48:00 | Will Watson |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 18:12:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:49:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 11:50:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 12:03:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 12:18:00 | Vanessa Smith |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 13:05:00 | Richard Greenhough |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 14:32:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 12:16:00 | Jill Merrett |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 12:31:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 13:05:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 14:39:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 12:03:00 | Ian Fillingham |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 12:16:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 14:16:00 | Michael Brown |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 14:43:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 15:17:00 | Madeleine Hazard |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 17:13:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 15:50:00 | Claire Moran |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 15:53:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 15:56:00 | Claire Moran |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:01:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:20:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:26:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:49:00 | Loraine Pemberton |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 17:18:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 18:02:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 18:10:00 | Carl Wynne |
| Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 15:15:00 | Glenn Manoff |
| Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 15:19:00 | Madeleine Hazard |
| Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:45:00 | Michael Brown |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 16:53:00 | Ian Fillingham |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 17:20:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 18:15:00 | Jill Merrett |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 18:29:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:telling bad jokes | 02/07/16 18:47:00 | Adrian Irving |
| Re:Re:telling bad jokes | 02/07/16 19:04:00 | Adrian Irving |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Hey! | 02/07/16 18:52:00 | bobby osborne |
| Loraine dirty laundry | 02/07/16 19:58:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Loraine dirty laundry | 02/07/16 21:22:00 | Carrie Reichardt |
| Re:Re:Loraine dirty laundry | 03/07/16 06:56:00 | Adrian Irving |
| Re:Re:Re:Loraine dirty laundry | 03/07/16 10:40:00 | Donna Fraser |
| Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 02/07/16 21:28:00 | Carrie Reichardt |
| Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 02/07/16 22:11:00 | Michael Brown |
| Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 02/07/16 23:03:00 | Ian Fillingham |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 00:29:00 | T P Howell |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 00:38:00 | Claire Moran |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 00:47:00 | T P Howell |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 01:13:00 | Paul Morris |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 13:27:00 | Claire Moran |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 14:00:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| not hey, but 'I dunno' | 03/07/16 07:56:00 | Alan Clark |
| Re:not hey, but 'I dunno' | 03/07/16 11:30:00 | Michael Brown |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 06:14:00 | Ken Munn |
| "The British Public has had enough of experts" | 03/07/16 11:27:00 | T P Howell |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 11:29:00 | Brian Coyle |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 12:22:00 | T P Howell |
| Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 12:35:00 | Matteo Castagna |
| Re:Loraine - liar liar pants on fire | 03/07/16 14:41:00 | John Whitworth |
| Re:Re: Help is coming | 04/07/16 10:13:00 | Carrie Reichardt |
| Re:Re:Re: Help is coming | 04/07/16 10:36:00 | Richard Greenhough |